putting a steel pin in brass

[willofiam]

Hello, I have tried to find out the best way to insert a steel pin into brass, I have turned pins with a shoulder but I dont see this on original movements, This project today is a Salem ships clock and the picture shows part of the hammer stop lever for the odd counts. The rack hits this pin on the last lift of the rack, pushing another pin on the opposite end of this piece into the way of the hammers drop thus producing a odd count. I have as in this case slightly tapered the pin and punched it into place but I did not feel it was strong enough so I used silver solder also on the backside. The previous smith had tried to solder a broken part of this lever and had soldered the pins onto it. they were both loose and all bent up so I made this brass lever and new pins ect….Seems to me you should be able to puch a steel pin in and be on your happy way but it always seems to be a process Could it be I am thinking there would be more force on this pin than really is????(or any other for that matter?) It always seems to me when putting a pin into a wheel or something like this it is tight but it feels like it will loosen over time (maybe I should leave it alone and quit monkeying with it). a chime wheel stop pin spinning until it hits a lever seems like alot of force on the pin. Anyone know the proper way to accomplish putting a steel pin into a brass wheel or lever? do I need more coffee? should I get a lobotomy? William

[randy]

Dear William !
The lobotomy won’t help…had one done years ago according to my 1st wife,..I’m still the same bloke !
I would think that tapping the plate, and threading the pin would solve the issue ?
Or if you could figure out how to get enough pin through the plate , so that you could peen the end flat ?

Just my wacky thoughts…

Randy

[willofiam]

Hey Randy, Thanks, you made me laugh, I cant seem to remember if I already had a lobotomy or not, oh well, if I did then it would make more sense. I know what you are saying and yes threading a pin in would be the ultimate, this pin is about .8 mm, trying to peen the back side over is where the trouble begins, if it is not held perfectly then it will loosen the brass hole (then again I am probably doing it wrong). looking at a newer movement say like a hermele the pins are just pushed through the hole, maybe I need to try some more experiments with a pin much larger than the hole and really jam it in. I also think my issue on this particular project is that the brass lever the pin is passing thru is so thin. William

[randy]

I understand William.
A snug press-fit may be your only option.

All the best ,

Randy

[arutha]

Having done similar jobs I found the most important thing was to make sure a) the initial hole was quite small compared to the pin diameter, b)it is hammered in straight, any adjusting stretches the brass and makes the pin loose, c) rough the pin up a little so its not smooth and less liable to move, d) if all else fails…. solder it
Paul.

[willofiam]

Thanks guys, thinking about this today I wonder if keeping the pin straight NOT tapered would hold better, the thought is that there would be more material surface contact between the pin and the place it is inserted into, at least a even force of holding (if that makes sense). along with Pauls suggestion about roughing it up a bit(at least at the part that will be in the brass) might be onto something here. I will do some experimentation soon if I dont go crazy before then, William

[david pierce]

William,
A small drop of high strength LOCTITE will hold the pin. If you ever want to release the joint just apply some heat from a small torch.
david

[willofiam]

Hey David, I have never used high strength loctite, I will have to look for some and add it to the experimentation. what type of applications is it normally used for? Oh and thank you for all your incite on the forum, I learn alot, William

[david pierce]

William,
It is an extremely strong bonding material to hold metal parts together in this type of application. We used to use it to hold steel dowel pins in steel shafts. It will also work on brass, aluminum, titaniam etc. It is also used in the manufacture of small electric motors to hold the cooling fan on to the motor shaft.
david

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