Missing pendulum

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  • #48065
    estanek70
    Participant
    • Topics Started: 14
    • Total Posts: 32

    I have just been given an Arts and Crafts tall case clock to overhaul. The movement is an Ingraham that looks as if it was originally intended for a wall clock. It is mounted to the back of the face of the clock rather than shelf mounted and it is spring driven. The main problem I have is that the pendulum is missing. There is part of a suspension spring remaining but that and a three inch long crutch are all that is left of the pendulum assembly. The crutch opening at the lower end is about 1/4 inch square. Does anyone have any idea how to determine what I should be looking for to replace the pendulum? I have experimented with a couple of different make shift pendulums, but the movement will only run for about fifteen seconds before it stops. I would appreciate any help someone has to offer.

    Ed Stanek

    #50705
    Bob Tascione
    Moderator
    • Topics Started: 38
    • Total Posts: 1552

    Hi Ed,
    Sorry for not getting to your post earlier but I’ve been away from the forum for a few days. If you haven’t already solved your missing pendulum problem there’s a simple formula you can use to determine what the approximate length of the pendulum should be. I would be happy to post it up here for you if you would like it. It’s also possible to figure it out rather quickly by trial and error. You mentioned that part of the suspension spring is still there and that you’ve been experimenting with a couple of makeshift pendulums (good idea) but that the movement only runs for a few seconds. I was wondering to what and how you are attaching your test pendulums. You would need to instal a new suspension spring to place the hanger or pendulum onto for testing. Otherwise the clock will most likely stop on you. Any chance you could post a pic of the back of the movement up here?

    Thanks Ed,
    Bob

    #50706
    estanek70
    Participant
    • Topics Started: 14
    • Total Posts: 32

    Bob, I have found a couple of formulas for calculating the length of the pendulum and the answer is between 12 and 13 inches. One thing that concerns me is that none of the sources I’ve found talk about the weight of the rod or the bob. I was using a 1/4 inch dowl to simulate the pendulum and I cut a slot into the top of the dowl and slid it over the end of a new suspesion spring that I cut to the same length as the original. I tried different weights for the bob but none of them has as yet worked. I am about to order a pendulum of the correct length from Timesavers. Their tech guy suggested the one I am ordering. I’m not sure how to post a photo in the forum, so I will send you an e-mail with the photo. This movement has really been abused. One of the main springs was completely broken, two of the wheels were bent and several teeth had to be straightened. The arbor for T-1 was loosened from the wheel and I am in the process of trying to rerivet the wheel back to the arbor. If you have any suggestions about that I would be all ears. Thanks for your help.

    Ed

    #50707
    Bob Tascione
    Moderator
    • Topics Started: 38
    • Total Posts: 1552

    Hi Ed,
    Thanks…got your picture and have pasted it below for you. Sounds like you’ve tested everything correctly. If it’s still stopping on you while testing then it can be a number of things. If the movement is now in good shape ie: cleaned, oiled, bushed where needed etc. and it’s still stopping right away during the test then you may want to check the following. Check that there is some clearance (important) between the dowel and where it passes through the crutch loop. Also the locking depth for the half dead beat is less forgiving than the recoil. From the way it looks in the pic it’s possible that the locking is too deep. You may want to back the pallets away from the escape wheel a little to see if things work better for you.
    Timesavers will probably get it right as far as the weight of the bob (pendulum). I believe it should be between 2 to 3 ounces for your Ingraham. If the movement’s in good shape then even if you’re off on the pendulum weight it should still run well enough to test things.

    T1 loose: I don’t have an Ingraham movement to look at with me and not sure of the setup used on your Ingraham. Hate to do this to you again Ed but if it’s possible…got a pic? Riveting (tightening) T1 back onto the arbor shouldn’t be too difficult and I would be happy to help if I can. If you can get a pic of the front and back of the assembly and send them to my email I’ll post them up here and will do my best to help.

    Thanks Ed,
    Bob

    #50708
    Bob Tascione
    Moderator
    • Topics Started: 38
    • Total Posts: 1552

    For others that may be following this thread I am posting (with Eds permission) the following email message and pics (below) that I received from him.

    Bob, attached is the T-1 pic that you requested. As you can see, I am attempting to rerivet the arbor to the wheel. This arbor is 2 7/8 inches long, and the wheel has 80 teeth.I have filed down the arbor slightly to provide a little more “shoulder” to peen over and complete the rivet. I tried to find another assembly in the Timesavers catolog but they don’t have any thing available. I considered trying to solder the arbor to the wheel, but I am not sure if it would hold.If you have any other suggestions, I am very open to them. Thanks for you help.
    I am using a T-1 from a Sessions clock that I have to test the pendulum length. The wheel is the same size, but the arbor is shorter so I cannot use this T-1 as a replacement.

    Hi Ed,
    Thanks again for the pics. They’re a big help.
    You mentioned soldering the wheel to the arbor. This wouldn’t work as the arbor must be able to turn independent of the wheel when winding the spring while the wheel stays engaged (stopped) with the rest of the train. The wheel should fit snug (no wobbling around) but not too snug. This tension is accomplished by the amount of pressure being applied to the tension washer by the rivet. If you’ve run out of rivet, which happens, you can often press the brass collet (on the arbor that the backside of the wheel rests against) back a tiny bit with a punch. You won’t need to move it much at all…just enough to give you some new metal to smack. I can’t tell from the pic but often times the rivet is actually punched down in four corners rather than around the entire rivet face. You have a better perspective on that and can decide what will work best.
    I hope this helps and that I’m not missing anything.

    Please let us know how it goes Ed and thanks again for sending those pics. (Pics Below)
    Enjoy,
    Bob


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estanek70Missing pendulum