Hamilton 974 16s issue

[mclark3617]

Ok so earlier I asked about jewels for this watch and found a bottom jewel on ebay and it installed fine seems to look fine however the balance is still loose. I’m thinking someone else has worked on it and maybe replaced the top jewel in the balance cock and its the wrong one. the balance cock did have peen marks on it in an attempted to fit tighter on the balance. I have honed those off and was using shim stock to try to see if I can get a better fit but it almost always starts binding up as I do. So I think either the top jewel is wrong or maybe the balance shaft is too short. I have some pics to show you, let me know if anything stands out.
and does anyone have any info on the overall length of the balance shaft, and info on the top jewel dimensions so I can check out what I have. Thanks

• This topic was modified 3 years ago by Tamas Richard.

[mclark3617]

• This reply was modified 3 years ago by Tamas Richard.

[tmac1956]

Mclark3617:

There’s a link on the opening page that takes you through one way of reducing the dimensions of your images. The simple way that I do it is to use MS Paint. Just right click on the image, click “Open With”, select “Paint” and the image will load into the Paint application. From the Home tab, locate the “Image” group and click on the “Resize” check box. You will now see the Resize and Skew dialog box. At the very top of the dialog box, select the “Pixels” radio button. I usually set the Horizontal pixels to around 600. The default is to maintain aspect ratio, so the Vertical will be set to suit for you.

I hope this helps,
Tom

[randy]

Can you describe ” still loose ” ?
Are you talking the side shake…or end shake- up and down ?
If it’s side shake and you are getting some “wobbling” in the balance as it runs, it could be the jewels.
There can be 1-3 different hole sizes on balance jewels depending on the movement. The one you replaced may have a larger hole than the other.
It doesn’t take much of a difference.
I just went through this with a Hamilton 940 when I had to replace a cracked balance jewel.

If it’s end shake..there’s possibly an issue with the length of the staff, maybe the depth of the jewels ( not as likely)

Do either of these sound close ?

[randy]

Go to this link

http://www.balancestaffs.com/hamilton.php
Your 16 should take one of the 434 or 435 staffs if that’s what you need.
If you click on “more info” you will see all the dimensions.

Note that there are small collet and large collet types. You’ll have to measure yours to see
Otto frei also has examples of the differences
http://www.ofrei.com/page322.html

Good luck Mclark !!

[mclark3617]

Alot of up down play thats why i was suspecting having the wrong jewel or jewels in it. I believe the pivot holes are fine but i am questioning the depth which the jewels are seating

[randy]

OK.
I would remove the jewel setting screws, and make sure that the settings themselves are fully seated. They should be fitting flush with the top of the plates. Then run the screws down flush, making sure that the pockets they sit in line up real nice and tight with the cutouts on the edges of the jewel settings. You may have to remove some small burrs, etc, to get a good clean setup.
Sometimes if the watch has been put together may times, or even dropped, they can be riding up a bit, and that can add to the excessive end-shake

[mclark3617]

With the top jewel it seems like the jewel is still loose even after i tighten the cap, i measured the balance and its the right length

[randy]

Not sure I’m seeing everything clearly..the setting is two piece ??? You have a mounted jewel and a top jewel ?

I hate to ask…but maybe take it out again..grab the brass chaton with some tweezers and see if you can move the jewel with a piece of pegwood. It shouldn’t float around at all.
If the setting is flush and the screws are all snugged down, and the jewel is still loose in the setting, you may simply have bad (loose) jewel setting, which could cause the binding you are experiencing.

Let me know !!!

[mclark3617]

Ive ordered a top jewel and when it comes in ill compare it to what i have,,i know the jewel is loose in the setting even after i screw down the cap. I suspect the last person to work on this just located a jewel of similar size and used it. Ill know more when i can compare the jewel of the right stock number.

[chris mabbott]

Is it my eyes or does the bottom pivot look broken 😯

[randy]

Mclark…
sounds like a good plan…

RB

[mclark3617]

Pivots are fine..pics not so much

[bamadadof3]

There is also the possibility that someone bent the balance cock up at some point in it’s life to fix a to tight staff. The problem here is it’s hard to see it if they did it and it doesn’t take much to cause a problem. I’ve seen some severely bent but I also have one that was loose up and down no matter what i did and the only possibility was a bent cock.

my 2 cents – worth maybe 1 cent

Glenn

[bamadadof3]

Looking a little closer at your balance cock it looks to me like the pivot jewel isn’t seated all the way down flush with the cock? I’m looking at the B. Cock picture that shows it upside down. The problem is the top cap jewel setting looks like it is set perfect. I was thinking maybe you installed the pivot jewel upside down so the bottom edge wouldn’t seat in the cock right but if you did that then the top cap jewel normally would stick up too high. So- Maybe the top (B. cock) pivot jewel was replaced with wrong one causing it not to seat low enough in the cock? Just throwing ideas out maybe something will stick…..

Glenn

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