clock ratchet/ great wheel problem

[tracker]

I just started repairs to an Ingraham mantel clock and have some questions I need advice on. First the click springs on both great wheels were broken. I have replaced one so far, but both the great wheel and ratchet wheel are loose on the arbor. Is this normal? There is movement of the two wheels on both the time and strike arbors and there is a spring washer over the ratchet on both arbors. Should I try to tighten these wheels on the arbor somehow?

[willofiam]

Hey Tracker, I hope I am picturing your problem correctly…….they should be “snug” but not too tight or it will be difficult to wind the mainspring. Hard to say without actually having them in hand and seeing how loose they really are but you do not want them wobbling around or falling off the arbor either. The spring washer is made to have some pressure and allow for the great wheel to slip when winding the mainspring. If you get them too tight it can be a bear to loosen up again so if you decide to tighten them go at it slowly and carefully a little at a time. Have fun, William

[bernie weishapl]

William is right when he says do not over tighten because it is a bear to loosen it again. Neither wheel should wobble on the shaft especially the rachet wheel. The rachet wheel should be solid on the shaft and then the great wheel tightened down to it but loose enough to allow slippage while winding. If the rachet wheel is wobbly it means it can turn on the shaft which will let the mainspring let go which as you know can be bad. A picture of the great wheel on both sides without the mainspring would help so we can see what you have.

[tracker]

@Bernie Weishapl wrote:

William is right when he says do not over tighten because it is a bear to loosen it again. Neither wheel should wobble on the shaft especially the rachet wheel. The rachet wheel should be solid on the shaft and then the great wheel tightened down to it but loose enough to allow slippage while winding. If the rachet wheel is wobbly it means it can turn on the shaft which will let the mainspring let go which as you know can be bad. A picture of the great wheel on both sides without the mainspring would help so we can see what you have.

I measured the amount of play on the ratchet wheel and the great wheel on the arbor and the ratchet will move about 3 mm from side to side and the great wheel moves about 2mm. I compaired them to a spring arbor from an old New Haven everything there is rock solid.
If the wheels are loose enough to cause problems would they show up when I try to wind up the springs on the spring winder?
I noticed the old clicks look to have a notch worn in them which allow them to ride lower in the gear tooth of the ratchet. don’t know if that’s wear or design. I will try to down load pics if I can figure out how. Thanks . Carl

[bernie weishapl]

Carl you are right in that the rachet wheel should not move on the shaft. If I have one that does I remove it and use a chisel to tap on the shaft as if to make a spline marking on the shaft. Several of them around the shaft. This raises the metal around shaft so that when you put the rachet wheel back on it is tight. There will be some adjustment involved so as when you put the great wheel back on it will be snug but not snug enough that when you wind it will be tough to do.

As far as the clicks having a notch I have not seen that. If it does I file them to reshape them so they will fit solidly and fit the tooth shape of the rachet wheel.

[willofiam]

Hey Carl, Bernie has good advice. I think I know what you are saying @tracker wrote:

I noticed the old clicks look to have a notch worn in them which allow them to ride lower in the gear tooth of the ratchet

This would be wear, I file then polish that groove out if it is not too deep, as long as I stay parallel with the original surface it will not change the proper function or the click. believe it or not but those are designed with lever and force mathematics (please dont ask me the formulas, having a difficult time remembering my name today, more coffee I think 🙄 ), the idea is that the click will be forced into the ratchet wheel and stay locked considering the angles on the click and the ratchet wheel. If the wear is too deep then a new click will be in order or If you refile the surfaces wrong it can slip or not work with the its full intention. Have a great day, William

[Author]

Posts